Just The Facts

Hello everyone and welcome back to Deeper Waters where we are diving into the ocean of truth! We will return to our look at the relationship of science and religion, but I do have other matters to attend to and tonight, I’d like to look at a theme I see going on in debates. This is the idea that we do not spend time looking at the data. Instead, we look at everything but the data. For me, in a debate, I want the data. As Joe Friday would say “Just the facts!”

An example of this is a debate I am engaging in now on the topic of homosexual “marriage.” I am seeing the usual reply of being called a bigot. This in spite of the fact that I have no problem with homosexuals as people and I have had friends who are homosexuals and I am ardently against movements like that of Fred Phelps. I am a bigot because I am against homosexual marriage.

However, my wonder at that is that it is automatically assumed there are no good metaphysical reasons for my stance. Even supposing I have bad metaphysical reasons, I do have reasons other than “I hate homosexuals.” If I have some reason or reasons why I believe the traditional view should be upheld, then it does no good to say I am a bigot.

Furthermore, what does that do to people like David Benkof who runs the blog “Gays Defend Marriage.” Benkof is an open homosexual who believes marriage should be reserved for a man and for a woman and that the homosexual community should work on more important battles. Is he, an open homosexual, a bigot?

Our arguments could be exactly the same. When he gives them, the argument must be answered. When I give them, it can be dismissed because I’m a bigot.

In fact, let’s suppose that it was true that I was a bigot. Let’s suppose that I had a flaming hatred of homosexuals. What does that mean? Am I wrong? Are the arguments true if Benkof says them but false if I do? All it would prove is that I’m a jerk. It would not prove I am wrong.

For instance, consider an atheist like Christopher Hitchens who wrote “god Is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything.” This is a guy who it has been said could have his arguments summed up in this way; “There is no God and I hate Him.” I believe Hitchens and other new atheists despise religion. What am I to conclude? “These people hate religion, therefore God exists.”

That would be silly. I can look at their motives all I want, but in the end, I simply have to look at the data. What is the argument? What are its premises? What is its conclusion? What does it wish to prove? How strong are the reasons for believing in the argument?

Atheists can often make the mistake of discounting Christian apologists, philosophers, or NT scholars because they are Christians. It is an interesting technique to say “I’m going to only listen to evidence that comes from people that share the same viewpoint as I do.” It won’t be a shock if you don’t grow in your viewpoint then. Learning how your opponent thinks will help you with your own position and if your opponent is right, you are at least likely to find that out by honestly accessing his worldview.

This doesn’t mean that there aren’t times that motive isn’t important. The problem is that we jump to motive first as if that’s a reason we don’t have to listen to the argument. It’s a whole lot easier to debate an attitude than it is to debate a position. If we’re going to see an argument stand or fall, it stands or falls on the data.

The Christian should remember to test everything and hold fast to that which is true. When you get in an argument, remember what is most important, the data.

Farewell Ken Pulliam

Hello everyone and welcome back to Deeper Waters, where we are diving into the ocean of truth! We’re taking a detour from our look into the topic of science and Christianity. I had meant it to be shorter, but I have been given notice about someone in the skeptical community who passed away and someone who I had some interaction with.

Ken and I debated a few times on Theologyweb.com. Of course, we disagreed on our conclusions, but I believe there was a healthy respect there. I honestly liked Ken in many ways. In fact, earlier this year, he had emailed me somehow hearing that I was getting married, probably on Theologyweb.com. He wanted to send me his congratulations and encourage me to continue my education because too many students get married and they never finish their education then.

Ken had been an apologist for Christianity and even taught who apostasized, but he did not fit into a stereotype of atheists who don’t know the material. He was one who had a better understanding. Of course, I still think his understanding was wrong as he did not agree with it, but I do believe he made an effort. It was a huge step up from so many atheists today who don’t even think they need to bother studying theology in order to argue.

In a world with the Rational Response Squad and the new atheists, it can be refreshing to know that there are deeper levels to the debate than you will find in these kinds of writings. There are people who want to seriously debate the issues and they do not want to simply use sound bites in order to argue their position. I believe Ken really wanted to interact with the material on the other side and I think that is an example Christians should have. Christians need to know what the other side is thinking.

I sincerely hope that there came a time for Ken to return to the faith before he died. I really do. I think we Christians need to watch what we do when those who are non-Christians die. Death is not a happy thing. If someone dies without Christ, we should never celebrate that. We as Christians should have our hearts remembering why we do what we do and the importance of evangelism.

I recall when Stephen Jay Gould died that there were several creationists who were practically throwing a party that surely he must be really hot now. We should not respond in that way. The man was dead and we need to honor his life. We need to remember that the only reason any of us are avoiding Hell is the grace of God.

I understand that all of his family consists of believers. I sincerely hope that if they read this, that everything I have said here is respectful to Ken. I know he treated me with respect and I try to do likewise to someone like that. I was sorry to hear about the news and if you read this, my wife and I pray for your well-being.

R.I.P. Ken.

Halloween And Secondary Matters

Hello everyone and welcome back to Deeper Waters, where we are diving into the ocean of truth! Last night as I was checking up on some things online for the last time, I saw a comment on TheologyWeb where I debate that burned me in a thread on Halloween telling someone to go ahead and celebrate the night of Samhain. God had made his opinion clear on the matter however.

Now to me, Halloween is nothing wicked to celebrate, though some people can celebrate it in wicked means. This is the case for any holiday. On Thanksgiving, we can be tempted to gluttony. On Christmas, we can be tempted with materialism. On New Year’s Day, we can be tempted to get drunk. In any holiday, we need to watch why we are observing it.

That’s not what got me on this here however. To me, Halloween is a secondary matter. There’s nothing in Scripture that’s yea or nay, particularly since Halloween hadn’t been invented yet, but I believe we have some guidelines in 1 Cor. 8-10 and Romans 14 indicating that this is a secondary matter.

However, it is easy to say that God has spoken on something and leave it at that and then think the rest of us are living in sin if we acknowledge the day. This gives us a chance to look at ourselves with pride and look down on our neighbor and think that we are doing better than they are or are more holy than they are. Now it could be we’re leading a better Christian life, but it is not our place to say that.

If we want to go with matters that the Lord has clearly stated his view on, let’s go with those.

We are commanded to love the Lord our God with all our heart, all our soul, and all our strength. How are we doing?

In Romans 12, Paul tells us to be devoted to prayer. I know this is something that I wrestle with. How about the rest of you? Are you doing much better?

We are told to love our neighbor as ourselves. Are we doing that, or are we treating our neighbor totally different from ourselves and looking for any excuse to not love him?

We are commanded if we are married men to love our wives as Christ loved the church and women are called to submit to their husbands as the church to Christ. Fellow marrieds? How are you doing? Husbands? Do you love your wives that way? Wives? Are you respecting your husbands?

Jesus told us to not worry about tomorrow for today has enough difficulties of its own. How’s that going? Are you getting good at not staying up at night and wondering about the future?

We are told to not look at women with lust and not hate our brother in our hearts. How’s that going?

Forgive one another as I have forgiven you. That’s an easy one surely isn’t it? Are you doing the work that needs to be done in forgiving your neighbor and actually letting it go? Surely no one ever carries around a grudge.

How about money? How are we doing? Are we giving to the poor and helping them or are we more greedy?

But in each of these, God has made his view clear.

We can argue about secondary issues and we should respect one another’s opinions on secondary issues even when we disagree, but before we start playing the pride card, let’s look and see how we’re doing on these other issues.